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The 1990s were a golden era

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for The Walt Disney Company.

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The Little Mermaid revived the company

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from the edge of bankruptcy.

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Beauty and the Beast earned
a Best Picture nomination.

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And The Lion King broke box
office records worldwide.

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But the reality just miles
away was no fairy tale.

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In 1992, a state jury acquitted

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four LAPD officers on almost all charges

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in the beating of Rodney G. King.

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The response was anger.

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Fire, chaos,

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massive citywide destruction.

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It was a pivotal moment for
Black culture in the '90s.

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But it's a little-known fact
that another cultural milestone

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emerged from that fateful day.

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- _
- It's a story so unbelievable,

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it could only happen in Hollywood.

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How did this young,
Black, unassuming animator

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from East Atlanta wind up

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as the CEO of Disney

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at the company's most
powerful moment in time?

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_

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_

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credits

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- Okay, rolling.
- Speed.

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- _
- Believe it or not,

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we named him after Tom Jones.

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Yeah!

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His father used to play Tom Jones.

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That's how he first courted me.

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He would do a little
dance and we would laugh.

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? I got to tell you a story ?

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? Every man ought to know... ?

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Usually, the boys in Ronald's family

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was named after their fathers,

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but when we had our boy, we knew that

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he was gonna be different,

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so we had to do something different.

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We had to name him Thomas.

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T loved cartoons something crazy.

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I mean, he was always
drawing on his desk, uh,

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in, uh, in the margins of his
notebook, in the textbooks,

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all on the walls, man.

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He just drove our teachers crazy.

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- He was obsessed with this one cat named...
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Blasto Boy? No, no, no, Astro Boy.

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Yeah, yeah, I used to watch it with him,

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and I remember thinking...

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this is kind of boring.

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But Thomas loved it, man.

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He drew... he drew that dude everywhere.

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One time, he asked me, he said,

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"What if Astro Boy
came here and saved us?"

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I said, "Saved us from what?"

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And he just kind of shrugged
and said, "Everything."

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I mean, what kind of eight-year-old

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is thinking like that, you know?

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I mean, I think he was scared.

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He wasn't no punk, I'm
just saying, I don't

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think he ever understood
why the world was so unfair.

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And where we were growing up...

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it was, like, unfair unfair, you know?

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I mean, you could be
sitting at home watching

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a program with white
folks with nice houses.

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We couldn't even ride
ours bikes outside,

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cause niggas will take it from you.

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Straight to your face,
they do not care. Crime?

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What, so? They will
ride your bike in front

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of your house the next day.

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Yeah, unfair.

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The boys picked on him.

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He would come home sometimes with pages

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torn out of his little sketchbook.

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Yeah, we would call him white.

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We was just messing with him.

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Um, I think he was
just trying to fit in,

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but he wasn't really like us, you know?

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And the kids would call him on it.

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I mean, he just wanted to draw,

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and he didn't understand why
that wasn't "cool," you know?

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I mean, niggas will make
fun of you for anything,

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and I don't think Thomas
was built to take it.

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I told him, "Son,

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one day, ain't none of
this gonna even matter."

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In 1987, Thomas left
East Atlanta to attend

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Savannah College of
Art and Design, or SCAD.

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It was here that Thomas's

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creative dreams began to take shape.

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We didn't have a lot of Black
students in the program then.

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Thomas showed a lot of promise.

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In his application, he
wrote about how he wanted

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to work at Disney one day.

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We usually laugh at that sort of thing.

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Everybody says that, you know?

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But with his application,
he sent a little flip-book.

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Can you see this?

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I mean, he had the sensibility

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and the wit of a true Disney animator.

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Art Babbitt was a big name at
Disney Animation for a time.

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As an animator in the '30s and '40s,

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he racked up a lot of credits,

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and enemies,

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but he was most well-known for

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developing the character of Goofy.

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He came to SCAD, and he spoke.

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_

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_

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_

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_

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Thomas really gravitated to him.

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He became obsessed,
and he really glommed

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on to Babbitt's article
"Analysis of the Goof."

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Art describes Goofy.

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He says, "Think of
the Goof as a composite

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"of an everlasting optimist,
a gullible Good Samaritan,

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"a half-wit, a shiftless,

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"good-natured colored boy,

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"and a hick.

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"He is loose-jointed

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"and gangly, but not rubbery.

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"He can move fast if he
has to, but would rather

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"avoid overexertion,

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"so he takes what seems the easiest way.

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"He is a philosopher of
the barber shop variety.

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"No matter what happens,
he accepts it finally

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as being for the best
or at least amusing."

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Thomas used this text
as the center of a piece

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of a series he called "Goofy, Please."

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After class one day, he
showed me some of these pieces,

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and I looked at it, and I looked at him,

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and I thought,

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"This kid is from another universe,

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like, a whole another planet."

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Thomas would be like, "Hey, come on,

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you know Goofy's a [BLEEP]."

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And we would just laugh, man.

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We just thought that was so funny.

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It was clear that
Thomas was very talented.

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For his thesis,

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he made this incredible short film.

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- ? Well, I'd like to visit the moon ?
- _

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? On a rocket ship
high in the air... ?

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He had little screenings;

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teachers would come, and students.

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The film felt so deep.

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I-I think it was
somehow connected to him

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losing his father in freshman year.

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? I would miss all
the places and... ?

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Uncle Ronnie dying changed him, man.

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Thomas was in his freshman year at SCAD,

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and I didn't think he was
going to make it, but, uh,

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once we buried my Uncle Ronnie, man,

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he, uh... it's like his brain exploded.

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Depending on who saw
it and when they saw it,

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it was either the funniest thing,

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or the saddest thing you'd ever seen.

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That short was what got him into Disney.

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No question.

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Washington comes to Disney

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right out of college, fresh from SCAD.

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You know, he's there, the
company's doing pretty well,

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they've just had their hit
with The Little Mermaid.

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One of the things that-that
I'm glad that I was

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able to be part of was that, um,

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Disney instituted
this diversity program.

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We knew that we needed
to bring in younger voices

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from a diversified point of view,

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and that would actually, uh,

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strengthen our company.

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And Thomas was one
of the first of those.

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Thomas started out at Disney
as an assistant animator

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on DuckTales the Movie:
Treasure of the Lost Lamp.

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It wasn't necessarily creative work,

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but things are fine, you know.

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It's not really moving
as fast as he wants things

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to be moving, but he's doing all right.

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And then the uprisings happened.

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When the shooting happened,

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and then the riots,

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Thomas was working in L.A.

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He called me and he said, "Mama,

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I just want to go down there."

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And I told him,

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"Son, you need to riot

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with that pen and paper."

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He was shook.

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I could see it in him, he was shook.

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He actually called me
one time and was like,

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"If I ever get the chance
to do a movie around here,

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I'm not holding back."

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While South Central Los Angeles

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was engulfed in flames,

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15 miles north in Burbank,
another fire was about to erupt.

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What happened next is
one of the most unlikely

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and unprecedented events in the
history of corporate America.

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After the success of
Beauty and the Beast,

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Michael Eisner put Dennis
Stephenson in charge

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while he went on a sabbatical.

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But two weeks into the job,

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Stephenson had a health emergency

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and passed shortly thereafter...

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leaving the job open once more.

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We all voted for this guy

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named Tom Washington.

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But we didn't realize

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that Tom's first name

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was actually Thompson, not Thomas.

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Thomas Washington was an animator.

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People were pretty
upset when they found out

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they voted for the wrong man.

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It felt like an honest mistake that we

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could sweep under the rug, but

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after Beauty and the Beast,

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there were a lot of eyes on us.

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We tried to handle it smoothly,

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but Thomas held our feet to the fire.

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So, because of this, you
know, "behind closed door,

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boys' club" handshake,

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Disney is now in radical

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new territory but entirely by default.

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So you have this young animator,

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this young, Black animator

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who comes into this company,
all of a sudden has a ton

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of power at a hugely
culturally significant moment,

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and he wants to do something with it.

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He wants to prove himself.

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This cat was on my line
with some foolishness,

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talking about he's the CEO of Disney.

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I was, I was crying laughing.

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And then, you know, he
took me to his office

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and people was, like, greeting him.

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- First day, he took us all into a room
- _

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that we call the stock room,
which is where everybody

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hangs out before we get to work.

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And he shows us a frame of animation

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of Goofy in Mickey's trailer, and, uh,

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Mickey has Pluto on a leash.

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And it gets real quiet,

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and, uh, Washington goes,

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"Why is Goofy letting Mickey do that?"

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He's a very fine dog, sir.

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And, you know, we're all
confused, we're just looking

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at each other, and Charlie
goes, "What do you mean, sir?"

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And Washington goes, "Goofy's a dog,

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"and Pluto's a dog, so
why is he letting Mickey

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do that to one of his own?"

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- Yeah, T had them running scared from day one.
- _

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I was, uh, fresh-faced
and wild-eyed.

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I was an inbetweener
for about three years,

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didn't see much movement.

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An inbetweener was usually for
animators just starting out.

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So, say a character slaps
somebody across the face.

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00:14:04,671 --> 00:14:07,859
They would get a senior
artist to do the fun part,

259
00:14:08,085 --> 00:14:12,912
drawing the first and the last
frame that define the movement.

260
00:14:13,343 --> 00:14:17,867
The inbetweener draws all the
many little frames in between.

261
00:14:19,314 --> 00:14:21,228
I was stuck as an inbetweener

262
00:14:21,253 --> 00:14:23,204
for years and years,

263
00:14:23,229 --> 00:14:25,647
but as soon as Thomas came in, he said,

264
00:14:25,672 --> 00:14:28,563
"I want you to be
lead director on this."

265
00:14:29,417 --> 00:14:32,460
And I said, "On what?" And he said,

266
00:14:32,956 --> 00:14:35,859
"The Blackest movie of all time."

267
00:14:39,032 --> 00:14:43,438
He said he wanted to make a
movie about Black fatherhood.

268
00:14:44,891 --> 00:14:47,915
Man, he wanted to tackle
everything in this movie.

269
00:14:48,063 --> 00:14:51,739
Segregation, single parenting,

270
00:14:51,740 --> 00:14:54,332
low-income career trajectories,

271
00:14:54,357 --> 00:14:58,402
fear of gang violence, incarceration,

272
00:14:58,427 --> 00:15:02,115
the amount of cheese in
African-American diets.

273
00:15:02,396 --> 00:15:06,407
He wanted to make a movie that
covered all this and more...

274
00:15:06,432 --> 00:15:09,727
and he said he knew the
perfect character to do it.

275
00:15:10,188 --> 00:15:12,954
_

276
00:15:12,979 --> 00:15:17,331
Thomas, man, he knew that people thought

277
00:15:17,356 --> 00:15:20,395
Goofy was dumb, but he wanted to show

278
00:15:20,420 --> 00:15:23,282
the systemic factors that
Goofy was dealing with.

279
00:15:23,482 --> 00:15:26,514
A shitty job, angry kid,

280
00:15:26,539 --> 00:15:30,120
and embarrassed by
his lack of influence.

281
00:15:30,649 --> 00:15:36,024
Man, it was wild how deep
he leaned in to all this,

282
00:15:36,049 --> 00:15:38,024
'cause, uh, as far as I knew,

283
00:15:38,049 --> 00:15:41,572
Thomas had a really solid homelife.

284
00:15:41,799 --> 00:15:44,706
It's a vacation with
me and my best buddy.

285
00:15:44,731 --> 00:15:46,098
Oh, Donald Duck?

286
00:15:46,145 --> 00:15:48,337
No, silly, with you!

287
00:16:01,680 --> 00:16:04,944
Thomas and I, we were married young.

288
00:16:05,918 --> 00:16:08,276
- We didn't have much,
- _

289
00:16:08,301 --> 00:16:11,667
and, um, you know what, he never

290
00:16:11,692 --> 00:16:15,147
let that get in the way of us, though.

291
00:16:15,172 --> 00:16:17,128
If there was something
we couldn't afford,

292
00:16:17,153 --> 00:16:18,697
he would just draw it.

293
00:16:18,740 --> 00:16:21,830
You know, you'd wake up and I would

294
00:16:21,855 --> 00:16:27,158
see anything from a coffee
maker to a solid-gold jet

295
00:16:27,541 --> 00:16:30,809
on the refrigerator in the morning.

296
00:16:30,873 --> 00:16:32,563
That was Thomas.

297
00:16:33,822 --> 00:16:37,490
We-we had our son Maxwell pretty early.

298
00:16:37,515 --> 00:16:39,539
He and Thomas, they were inseparable.

299
00:16:39,564 --> 00:16:41,882
He did everything for that boy.

300
00:16:41,907 --> 00:16:44,375
Oh, my God, look at this...

301
00:16:44,418 --> 00:16:46,072
Oh, look at this!

302
00:16:46,540 --> 00:16:49,024
Thomas kept saying that

303
00:16:49,049 --> 00:16:52,360
A Goofy Movie was for him.

304
00:16:52,999 --> 00:16:57,306
He'd say, "If I'm not here,
you can show him this."

305
00:16:57,483 --> 00:17:01,035
I was too scared to ask
him what he meant by that.

306
00:17:01,458 --> 00:17:04,960
To give you a little context,
when A Goofy Movie came out,

307
00:17:05,161 --> 00:17:08,863
Black masculinity in the media
was in a really weird place.

308
00:17:08,888 --> 00:17:12,788
- Hello, I'm Blaine Edwards.
- And I'm Antoine Merriweather!

309
00:17:12,813 --> 00:17:15,319
And welcome to Men on Films.

310
00:17:15,344 --> 00:17:17,041
The show that looks at movies...

311
00:17:17,066 --> 00:17:19,498
From a male point of view.

312
00:17:19,523 --> 00:17:22,439
So on one hand, you've
got men doing, kind of

313
00:17:22,464 --> 00:17:25,637
"faux queer" comedy,
and on the other end

314
00:17:25,662 --> 00:17:29,237
of the spectrum, you've got
these hypermasculine portrayals.

315
00:17:31,576 --> 00:17:34,318
Am I my brother's keeper?

316
00:17:35,996 --> 00:17:38,055
Yes, I am.

317
00:17:40,235 --> 00:17:42,803
And, by contrast, Goofy

318
00:17:42,901 --> 00:17:45,971
is a nuanced portrayal of a Black man

319
00:17:45,996 --> 00:17:48,787
whose priority is his family.

320
00:17:49,290 --> 00:17:51,919
- What?
- Nothin'.

321
00:17:52,161 --> 00:17:55,469
Goofy really put forward
the philosophy that...

322
00:17:55,555 --> 00:17:59,477
just love your children for
who they are and accept them,

323
00:18:00,364 --> 00:18:02,147
and deal with the pain that the world

324
00:18:02,148 --> 00:18:04,095
is not going to love them like you do.

325
00:18:09,867 --> 00:18:12,389
_

326
00:18:12,414 --> 00:18:15,980
I think in the movie, Dad
laid in a lot of things.

327
00:18:16,574 --> 00:18:19,470
I-I notice it more now than I did then.

328
00:18:19,513 --> 00:18:21,514
? If I could make you
stop and take a look ?

329
00:18:21,539 --> 00:18:23,249
? At me instead of just... ?

330
00:18:23,274 --> 00:18:27,129
In the beginning, Max sings a song,

331
00:18:27,274 --> 00:18:31,640
dunks a basketball, and then
is cheered on by his peers.

332
00:18:32,396 --> 00:18:34,699
I think my dad was making a comment

333
00:18:34,724 --> 00:18:36,418
on Black exceptionalism

334
00:18:36,443 --> 00:18:39,246
and how some people believe

335
00:18:39,271 --> 00:18:43,842
that performative assimilation
is the best way to get by.

336
00:18:43,867 --> 00:18:48,219
My dad wanted to prove those
limitations were just that,

337
00:18:48,839 --> 00:18:51,554
limits put on us by outsiders.

338
00:18:52,293 --> 00:18:55,853
That's why he made it a fishing trip.

339
00:18:56,259 --> 00:18:58,496
It's the same one we used to take.

340
00:19:00,472 --> 00:19:03,322
The trip was supposed to start out

341
00:19:03,347 --> 00:19:05,603
as sort of like a freedom ride.

342
00:19:05,646 --> 00:19:08,040
And the map, which
is central to the plot

343
00:19:08,083 --> 00:19:12,783
of the film and also represented
Goofy's trust in his son Max,

344
00:19:13,119 --> 00:19:16,111
was supposed to remind the viewer

345
00:19:16,136 --> 00:19:18,633
of the Green Book and
how Black travelers

346
00:19:18,658 --> 00:19:21,813
had to use it to advance their way

347
00:19:21,838 --> 00:19:24,992
through the Jim Crow South
during the '30s and the '40s.

348
00:19:25,017 --> 00:19:27,330
A lot of the film had deeper meanings,

349
00:19:28,045 --> 00:19:33,544
and word got around that it
meant a lot more in Thomas's eyes.

350
00:19:33,886 --> 00:19:36,886
Dad wanted every Black
person in America to feel like

351
00:19:36,911 --> 00:19:41,892
they were just a road trip away
from being part of a movement.

352
00:19:42,076 --> 00:19:45,469
Even if their kids didn't
understand the stakes.

353
00:19:45,829 --> 00:19:49,746
It was about destiny
and how our children,

354
00:19:50,145 --> 00:19:52,467
our future, get to draw our path.

355
00:19:53,169 --> 00:19:54,902
I want to get us to doing something

356
00:19:54,927 --> 00:19:56,066
we've never done before.

357
00:19:56,091 --> 00:19:59,327
- We have never truly drawn authentically
- _

358
00:19:59,352 --> 00:20:01,914
Black characters,
characters that act...

359
00:20:07,273 --> 00:20:09,841
Now, see, this is
what I'm talking about.

360
00:20:10,145 --> 00:20:12,844
This is what I'm talking about.

361
00:20:13,348 --> 00:20:16,819
In order to draw
authentically Black characters,

362
00:20:16,844 --> 00:20:18,834
one has to know Black people.

363
00:20:18,859 --> 00:20:23,351
Okay? Now, Tom went out on assignment.

364
00:20:23,523 --> 00:20:26,967
Researched, hung out, went
to a couple Black cookouts.

365
00:20:26,992 --> 00:20:31,358
Said the wrong thing, got
his ass beat, but now, now?

366
00:20:31,383 --> 00:20:34,054
He's more aware, he's more knowledgeable

367
00:20:34,079 --> 00:20:36,490
of how to draw. Okay?

368
00:20:36,515 --> 00:20:38,970
Thomas tried to pull back and be more

369
00:20:38,995 --> 00:20:42,571
subtle with his message, uh,
when the complaints started,

370
00:20:42,596 --> 00:20:44,945
and we were getting
complaints from everywhere.

371
00:20:45,424 --> 00:20:50,315
But there was nothing
subtle about Thomas.

372
00:20:50,316 --> 00:20:53,891
At one point, he said he
didn't want Mickey in the movie.

373
00:20:53,916 --> 00:20:57,344
And, um, I kept saying, "But it's
Disney. What are you talking about?"

374
00:20:57,368 --> 00:20:58,741
_

375
00:20:58,766 --> 00:21:01,188
I can remember Thomas
ranting in his office,

376
00:21:01,213 --> 00:21:03,533
"They're trying to make me put
this white boy in my movie."

377
00:21:04,130 --> 00:21:07,425
And I'm thinking, "He's a mouse."

378
00:21:07,450 --> 00:21:09,285
He told me from the beginning,

379
00:21:09,310 --> 00:21:12,880
"I'm not here for a long time,
I'm here for a good time."

380
00:21:13,466 --> 00:21:15,774
Uh, he knew he was going to get fired,

381
00:21:15,799 --> 00:21:18,537
but the "when" of it was fun for him.

382
00:21:18,948 --> 00:21:20,408
It was like a game.

383
00:21:20,433 --> 00:21:26,003
We had 15, 16, sometimes 18-hour days.

384
00:21:26,004 --> 00:21:30,063
And, uh, he would be screaming,
"We don't dance like that."

385
00:21:30,088 --> 00:21:33,940
And he would bring his friend's kids in

386
00:21:33,965 --> 00:21:36,776
and, uh, they would moonwalk and,

387
00:21:36,801 --> 00:21:40,557
and, you know, do all, like,
you know, this stuff, you know?

388
00:21:40,582 --> 00:21:42,269
Oh, man, I must have drawn a pair

389
00:21:42,294 --> 00:21:45,588
of gloves dapping, I don't
know, over 5,000 times?

390
00:21:45,769 --> 00:21:48,408
I just kept hearing, "That's
not a dap, that's not a dap.

391
00:21:48,433 --> 00:21:49,627
Where's the snap?"

392
00:21:49,652 --> 00:21:50,993
You see my knees?

393
00:21:51,058 --> 00:21:53,553
You see this, see this
angle of these knees?

394
00:21:53,597 --> 00:21:56,674
Draw... Draw this! Get this down, okay?

395
00:21:56,699 --> 00:21:58,340
One time, I just couldn't take it...

396
00:21:58,384 --> 00:22:01,213
My fingers were just bleeding...
So I went up to talk to him,

397
00:22:01,238 --> 00:22:03,670
and he was up there drinking
whiskey with Robert Townsend,

398
00:22:03,694 --> 00:22:07,611
and Janet Jackson, uh,
Sinbad and Adina Howard.

399
00:22:07,848 --> 00:22:11,155
Well, when I poked my
head in, Thomas went,

400
00:22:11,180 --> 00:22:12,956
"Who ordered the white rice?"

401
00:22:12,981 --> 00:22:15,106
And they all just laughed,

402
00:22:15,131 --> 00:22:18,626
and, uh, I just didn't get it.

403
00:22:18,650 --> 00:22:20,504
Everybody used to be up there.

404
00:22:20,529 --> 00:22:24,219
- Eddie Murphy, Arsenio Hall, Kadeem Hardison,
- _

405
00:22:24,244 --> 00:22:28,205
Harrison Ford, it was crazy.
The parties were insane.

406
00:22:28,230 --> 00:22:31,407
- Imagine Disney after The Lion King.
- _

407
00:22:31,432 --> 00:22:34,131
You got this smooth-looking
brother at the helm.

408
00:22:38,007 --> 00:22:40,314
It was crazy he even had that office.

409
00:22:40,339 --> 00:22:42,217
Everyone would go up there and just hang

410
00:22:42,242 --> 00:22:45,307
as we plotted our
overthrow of Hollywood.

411
00:22:45,332 --> 00:22:47,116
You couldn't tell us nothing.

412
00:22:47,164 --> 00:22:49,288
They had a big musical number planned

413
00:22:49,313 --> 00:22:51,619
with Bryan Adams in the movie.

414
00:22:52,226 --> 00:22:55,237
And one day, Thomas asked me to come by

415
00:22:55,262 --> 00:22:57,007
and see what he's working on.

416
00:22:57,008 --> 00:22:59,184
And we're walking through,
and he stops in one

417
00:22:59,227 --> 00:23:01,120
of the rooms and plays
me some of the music.

418
00:23:01,145 --> 00:23:04,232
And I'm like, "Yeah,
you know, pop ballad.

419
00:23:04,319 --> 00:23:06,125
"You know, same old, same old.

420
00:23:06,150 --> 00:23:08,979
You know, it's-it's
good, it's-it's cool."

421
00:23:09,332 --> 00:23:11,979
But he asks me, "Who
do you like right now?"

422
00:23:12,085 --> 00:23:14,612
I'm like, "You know,
I-I've been listening

423
00:23:14,637 --> 00:23:16,331
to this Tevin Campbell."

424
00:23:16,375 --> 00:23:21,651
And from then on, it just
had to be Tevin Campbell.

425
00:23:21,676 --> 00:23:25,818
? Last night I, I saw you ?

426
00:23:25,819 --> 00:23:27,167
? Standing ?

427
00:23:27,168 --> 00:23:29,475
? And I started ?

428
00:23:29,519 --> 00:23:31,824
? Started pretending ?

429
00:23:31,887 --> 00:23:33,672
Most of the cats around there didn't

430
00:23:33,697 --> 00:23:35,481
even know who Tevin Campbell was.

431
00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:39,919
For three months, a lot of
them were saying Kevin Campbell.

432
00:23:41,056 --> 00:23:44,838
? Can we talk, baby, can
we talk for a minute? ?

433
00:23:45,368 --> 00:23:47,057
? Girl, I want to know your name ?

434
00:23:47,058 --> 00:23:49,451
? I want to know your name ?

435
00:23:49,495 --> 00:23:51,256
Thomas was a cool cat.

436
00:23:51,568 --> 00:23:54,096
But the brother definitely
had a chip on his shoulder.

437
00:23:54,121 --> 00:23:56,467
He didn't like it if you
challenged his Blackness.

438
00:23:58,730 --> 00:24:01,582
I think there was a part of Thomas

439
00:24:01,607 --> 00:24:04,864
that kind of felt that being an animator

440
00:24:04,889 --> 00:24:08,246
wasn't innately Black, you know?

441
00:24:08,271 --> 00:24:10,955
And he wanted to make it Black,

442
00:24:10,980 --> 00:24:12,549
he wanted to make it cool.

443
00:24:12,574 --> 00:24:16,627
He wanted to-to carve out
his own space and not feel

444
00:24:16,652 --> 00:24:20,338
that he was divorced from
his own culture, you know.

445
00:24:20,363 --> 00:24:23,635
He was loading his culture
into this stuff that

446
00:24:23,660 --> 00:24:26,345
we were doing so that
it just seemed normal

447
00:24:26,370 --> 00:24:29,660
and would seem normal to the rest of us.

448
00:24:29,685 --> 00:24:33,377
He had a lot of pressure, man...
The culture, the job itself,

449
00:24:33,402 --> 00:24:35,975
what-what he was trying to live
up to that I'm not even sure

450
00:24:35,976 --> 00:24:38,544
that he knew that he
could live up to it.

451
00:24:38,569 --> 00:24:41,852
And, uh, it had to
take a huge toll on him.

452
00:24:41,895 --> 00:24:44,071
One morning I walk in the
studio, I got my coffee,

453
00:24:44,115 --> 00:24:46,508
I'm ready to sit down,
get to busi... business.

454
00:24:46,552 --> 00:24:49,860
And Thomas like, "Psst!
Psst! Come here, come here!"

455
00:24:49,903 --> 00:24:52,776
So I go over there and,
uh, he's in his cubicle,

456
00:24:52,819 --> 00:24:56,344
he got this briefcase, he opens it up,

457
00:24:56,884 --> 00:24:58,242
there's a gun inside!

458
00:24:58,267 --> 00:25:02,664
I'm like, "Dude, what-what is this?

459
00:25:02,689 --> 00:25:04,222
What's it for?"

460
00:25:04,461 --> 00:25:08,829
And he's like, "This
is to remind me that

461
00:25:08,854 --> 00:25:11,117
they don't know who the fuck I am."

462
00:25:17,060 --> 00:25:19,731
Dad kind of started to lose it.

463
00:25:20,523 --> 00:25:23,396
He would stay up all
night, talk to hisself.

464
00:25:23,803 --> 00:25:27,809
After a while, Mom...
she had had enough.

465
00:25:30,084 --> 00:25:32,651
After a while, Mom
couldn't take it anymore.

466
00:25:32,871 --> 00:25:34,655
He had just gotten too mean.

467
00:25:36,562 --> 00:25:39,087
We had so much fun.

468
00:25:40,642 --> 00:25:43,291
But then, it wasn't fun anymore.

469
00:25:44,306 --> 00:25:46,641
He had been fooling around, yeah.

470
00:25:46,666 --> 00:25:50,398
And drinking a lot,
and he got pretty mean.

471
00:25:50,562 --> 00:25:53,822
He would say some mean,
nasty things to me,

472
00:25:53,847 --> 00:25:57,408
which he never, he had
never done that before.

473
00:25:59,146 --> 00:26:01,503
I remember at one time,
Maxwell tried to step in

474
00:26:01,528 --> 00:26:02,883
between his dad and I,

475
00:26:02,908 --> 00:26:06,041
and Thomas...

476
00:26:06,066 --> 00:26:09,200
was not kind. He kind of...

477
00:26:11,801 --> 00:26:14,292
He kind of raised his, um...

478
00:26:15,191 --> 00:26:17,338
he raised his fist...

479
00:26:18,191 --> 00:26:19,993
at Maxwell.

480
00:26:21,045 --> 00:26:23,663
That wasn't cool, because they...

481
00:26:23,688 --> 00:26:26,279
they had always been so close.

482
00:26:28,218 --> 00:26:29,795
He was a...

483
00:26:30,178 --> 00:26:32,254
he was a really good father.

484
00:26:32,420 --> 00:26:34,952
I mean, at least he
tried to be a good father.

485
00:26:36,210 --> 00:26:38,895
I kept saying, "Thomas,

486
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:41,013
"you're going to lose him,

487
00:26:41,896 --> 00:26:43,998
you're going to lose your son."

488
00:26:46,795 --> 00:26:50,513
But all he kept saying is...

489
00:26:50,749 --> 00:26:52,882
"But this is for him."

490
00:26:55,121 --> 00:26:58,191
I knew things were going downhill when

491
00:26:58,216 --> 00:27:00,230
Thomas's wife left him.

492
00:27:00,255 --> 00:27:02,431
Sh-She had been there
from the beginning.

493
00:27:03,427 --> 00:27:06,386
And he started sleeping in his office.

494
00:27:06,411 --> 00:27:10,130
And, um, one day, there
was a board meeting.

495
00:27:10,155 --> 00:27:14,812
All the Disney heads were
there, and they started talking

496
00:27:14,837 --> 00:27:18,579
about the budget was
going a bit high on Goofy.

497
00:27:18,899 --> 00:27:21,794
And one of the guys
asked Thomas, he said, uh,

498
00:27:21,838 --> 00:27:24,376
"Are you in control of the budget?"

499
00:27:24,598 --> 00:27:26,470
And Thomas said, "Of course I am.

500
00:27:26,495 --> 00:27:27,697
I'm Goofy."

501
00:27:28,811 --> 00:27:30,552
And then,

502
00:27:30,804 --> 00:27:34,714
he did this this chilling laugh. Like...

503
00:27:38,826 --> 00:27:42,119
You know, l-like Goofy, but broken.

504
00:27:43,146 --> 00:27:45,519
And it-it was terrifying, man.

505
00:27:46,191 --> 00:27:47,758
I almost started crying.

506
00:27:49,636 --> 00:27:51,868
He really thought he was Goofy.

507
00:27:58,520 --> 00:28:00,609
The company knew he had to go,

508
00:28:01,079 --> 00:28:04,781
but legally, he was still the CEO.

509
00:28:04,806 --> 00:28:08,299
That gentleman's show of hands was, uh,

510
00:28:08,565 --> 00:28:11,385
surprisingly hard to go back on.

511
00:28:11,844 --> 00:28:14,194
You know, they even tried to
buy him out of his contract.

512
00:28:14,532 --> 00:28:18,188
Yeah, they offered him, like $75,000.

513
00:28:18,213 --> 00:28:20,174
No, no.

514
00:28:20,713 --> 00:28:23,725
We offered him $75 million,

515
00:28:23,948 --> 00:28:26,026
paid out over ten years.

516
00:28:27,557 --> 00:28:31,124
Um, that's how... that's
how serious it was for us.

517
00:28:31,211 --> 00:28:32,952
I mean, he didn't take it.

518
00:28:33,222 --> 00:28:36,921
But, uh, maybe he should
have taken it, you know?

519
00:28:39,002 --> 00:28:42,309
He started getting really paranoid.

520
00:28:42,807 --> 00:28:46,096
He'd say he was afraid for his life,

521
00:28:46,686 --> 00:28:48,775
but he'd never say from whom.

522
00:28:50,065 --> 00:28:52,092
Suddenly, there were a
bunch of guys in bow ties

523
00:28:52,116 --> 00:28:53,905
hanging around the office.

524
00:28:53,930 --> 00:28:55,972
He introduced us to one of them saying,

525
00:28:55,997 --> 00:28:58,259
"I want you to meet my
new head of security,

526
00:28:58,905 --> 00:29:01,153
Al Shaheim X."

527
00:29:01,154 --> 00:29:03,808
The thing not a lot
of people knew about,

528
00:29:04,112 --> 00:29:07,201
was Thomas had been going around town

529
00:29:07,717 --> 00:29:11,226
letting a lot of people know
how huge this was going to be,

530
00:29:12,017 --> 00:29:15,828
and he had a lot of different
Black empowerment groups,

531
00:29:15,853 --> 00:29:20,312
radical movements, and just
straight-up gangs all wanting

532
00:29:20,337 --> 00:29:24,264
as much influence and subtle
shout-outs as the other.

533
00:29:25,360 --> 00:29:27,747
You know, I think that he had made

534
00:29:27,772 --> 00:29:30,376
way too many deals at one point.

535
00:29:30,612 --> 00:29:33,571
At least, that's what...
that's what I heard.

536
00:29:34,255 --> 00:29:39,331
Truthfully, it all came
down to the end of the movie.

537
00:29:40,445 --> 00:29:41,756
Really.

538
00:29:44,491 --> 00:29:46,808
Oh, man, the end of the movie.

539
00:29:46,929 --> 00:29:49,320
I heard he wanted Goofy
and Max to get pulled over

540
00:29:49,345 --> 00:29:52,087
early on and, uh, you know...

541
00:29:56,072 --> 00:29:59,702
Wh-Why would he do that?
That makes no sense.

542
00:30:00,468 --> 00:30:03,434
That Powerline concert at the end,

543
00:30:03,627 --> 00:30:06,306
it wasn't supposed to be all
hunky-dory, dancing-dancing.

544
00:30:06,350 --> 00:30:09,091
Nah, it wasn't supposed
to be like that at all.

545
00:30:11,417 --> 00:30:15,318
I heard Goofy was supposed
to get shot at the concert.

546
00:30:15,343 --> 00:30:17,100
You know, a Black man runs onstage

547
00:30:17,143 --> 00:30:19,994
like that at a major
venue? Come on, man.

548
00:30:20,268 --> 00:30:22,064
There's something wrong here.

549
00:30:22,089 --> 00:30:23,960
Thomas was trying to make a statement.

550
00:30:25,443 --> 00:30:28,736
Do you, uh, think his
death was an accident?

551
00:30:30,742 --> 00:30:32,396
Next question, man.

552
00:30:32,541 --> 00:30:34,047
No, I don't.

553
00:30:34,072 --> 00:30:36,119
I-I've never thought
it was an accident.

554
00:30:37,844 --> 00:30:39,263
Why not?

555
00:30:41,260 --> 00:30:42,633
Um, well...

556
00:30:43,540 --> 00:30:45,622
partly because of
his-his mood at the end,

557
00:30:45,647 --> 00:30:48,654
but, um, you know,
there was also the tape.

558
00:30:49,961 --> 00:30:51,267
What tape?

559
00:30:59,794 --> 00:31:02,947
? For the first time ever ?

560
00:31:03,575 --> 00:31:06,491
? Seeing it eye to eye ?

561
00:31:06,516 --> 00:31:09,338
_

562
00:31:09,363 --> 00:31:10,801
Oh, I'm so sorry.

563
00:31:10,833 --> 00:31:13,276
_

564
00:31:13,301 --> 00:31:15,020
Oh, man, I...

565
00:31:15,045 --> 00:31:20,177
Ooh, I'm close, I'm-I'm close...

566
00:31:21,297 --> 00:31:23,106
I'm so close.

567
00:31:36,738 --> 00:31:38,958
I got to finish this.

568
00:31:44,601 --> 00:31:46,864
I got to finish it.

569
00:31:50,018 --> 00:31:53,645
Back then, mental health wasn't
something that we talked about.

570
00:31:53,881 --> 00:31:55,964
I didn't even know what to characterize

571
00:31:55,989 --> 00:31:59,289
what I saw him going through,
what it... what it was.

572
00:31:59,332 --> 00:32:02,264
I just knew he was going
through something, um,

573
00:32:02,289 --> 00:32:05,205
something that was very, very
difficult for him to deal with.

574
00:32:07,659 --> 00:32:10,314
This is a little hard for me right now.

575
00:32:13,379 --> 00:32:15,653
I-I don't know why.

576
00:32:15,740 --> 00:32:20,439
When the news finally broke
that Dad was officially out,

577
00:32:20,941 --> 00:32:24,323
they let him back on the
lot for one final screening

578
00:32:24,348 --> 00:32:26,777
of what they were able to
piece together behind his back.

579
00:32:28,754 --> 00:32:30,191
He didn't know they had been working

580
00:32:30,215 --> 00:32:31,738
on the movie without him...

581
00:32:31,870 --> 00:32:34,730
changing and corrupting
his original vision.

582
00:32:35,972 --> 00:32:38,387
He-he didn't take the news well.

583
00:32:39,019 --> 00:32:40,854
I was at that last screening.

584
00:32:40,879 --> 00:32:43,551
It was the Bigfoot stuff
that put him over the edge.

585
00:32:43,682 --> 00:32:46,308
They'd added it without his knowledge.

586
00:32:46,597 --> 00:32:48,589
He'd wanted Goofy and Max

587
00:32:48,614 --> 00:32:50,854
to wander into a thrift store

588
00:32:50,879 --> 00:32:53,839
and discover Huey
Newton's rattan throne.

589
00:32:53,864 --> 00:32:57,251
And once they sat in it,
Max would finally understand

590
00:32:57,276 --> 00:32:58,800
what Goofy had been fighting

591
00:32:58,825 --> 00:33:01,278
to make him understand all along.

592
00:33:01,497 --> 00:33:06,006
Instead, they took out the
thrift store and the throne

593
00:33:06,311 --> 00:33:08,835
and put in that Bigfoot bit.

594
00:33:09,490 --> 00:33:11,934
It's like they were saying,
"What you were after,

595
00:33:11,959 --> 00:33:15,742
"your message, it's a fantasy as elusive

596
00:33:15,767 --> 00:33:18,311
and unreal as Bigfoot."

597
00:33:18,944 --> 00:33:20,467
You're going to see...

598
00:33:20,492 --> 00:33:22,407
you're going to be proud of me...

599
00:33:24,381 --> 00:33:26,376
I'm doing this for you.

600
00:33:26,624 --> 00:33:28,856
I'm doing this for all of us.

601
00:33:32,451 --> 00:33:34,043
Oh, man.

602
00:33:35,910 --> 00:33:39,238
I could feel him get up and leave

603
00:33:39,263 --> 00:33:42,948
and I-I heard the door close
and I went out after him,

604
00:33:42,973 --> 00:33:45,791
and by the time I got to
the parking lot, he was gone.

605
00:33:45,816 --> 00:33:49,149
Something... I don't know,
there was a look in his eye.

606
00:33:49,174 --> 00:33:51,715
He-he just got in the
car and he took off...

607
00:33:53,207 --> 00:33:54,624
and didn't come back.

608
00:34:01,891 --> 00:34:04,613
_

609
00:34:04,637 --> 00:34:07,170
_

610
00:34:07,195 --> 00:34:12,260
_

611
00:34:15,462 --> 00:34:17,253
They, um...

612
00:34:18,651 --> 00:34:20,472
they never found his body.

613
00:34:26,205 --> 00:34:30,840
I think that was...
especially hard for Mom.

614
00:34:34,446 --> 00:34:35,577
Dad!

615
00:34:39,362 --> 00:34:41,712
We actually watch...

616
00:34:41,737 --> 00:34:43,707
we watch the movies a lot.

617
00:34:44,582 --> 00:34:47,015
Uh, I couldn't for a while.

618
00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:51,498
But... but once I did, I couldn't stop.

619
00:34:55,750 --> 00:34:57,533
It's like, um,

620
00:34:57,558 --> 00:34:59,995
it was like having him around,

621
00:35:00,020 --> 00:35:02,806
you know, in a fun way.

622
00:35:03,193 --> 00:35:04,542
Yeah.

623
00:35:13,715 --> 00:35:17,762
You know that, uh, "Damn,
you live like this?" meme?

624
00:35:18,702 --> 00:35:22,227
It's so funny to me
because the essence of it

625
00:35:22,560 --> 00:35:25,014
is those drawings he did in college.

626
00:35:25,062 --> 00:35:29,371
Black folks living
their lives, being funny,

627
00:35:30,491 --> 00:35:33,967
being free, being real.

628
00:35:38,967 --> 00:35:41,037
He would've been really proud that

629
00:35:41,062 --> 00:35:43,066
he became part of the culture.

630
00:35:43,911 --> 00:35:45,918
I think that's what
he wanted in the end,

631
00:35:45,943 --> 00:35:47,918
to just be part of the family.

632
00:35:50,827 --> 00:35:53,155
And along the way...

633
00:35:53,457 --> 00:35:57,488
he made the Blackest movie of all time.

634
00:35:57,872 --> 00:36:03,301
_

635
00:36:04,100 --> 00:36:11,600
Synced and corrected by Octavia
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